Bringing Along Young Horses

[Laura Coffey]

I have a 6 Y/O Connemara X( the X includes a bit of Arab). I have been riding him for 2 years, seriously working him in dressage for a year. He had a lengthy childhood romping about in the pasture, being a short backed horse not a bad thing. He's smart, charming, handsome and talented, all wonderful qualities...do you hear the "but" coming. Much like my 20 year old son he seems to have problems with authority, or in dressage speak, lacks submission. He has an opinion about everything we do, which is usually contrary to mine. Mind you I am no push-over nor am I an inexperienced horse person. (In my younger days I used to rehab off-the-track TB's and sell them as riding horses.) On one hand I feel that this problem is the result of his intelligence and spirit which I love. On the other I feel like arguing with a horse who has temper tantrums when he doesn't get his way is counter productive. I've never ridden a horse like this before! Is there anyone out there who has had some luck with a similar creature?Laura

[Cindi Roberts]

Daer Laura, I have always worked with Hunters and TBs so I was used to a certain temperment of horse. I was recently working with two Arab geldings and one sweet arab cross mare, and I found that they bored quite easily. I had to keep each days work different so they would engage with me, otherwise a sassy stubborn streak would emerge. Once I realized they were thinking several steps ahead, buy mixing up the program they became quite lovely to work with. I did daily in hand work then a break, then under tack in the afternoon.
Cindi
The Cheerful Yellow Barn, Ocala FL

[Diana Murphy]

Yes... I have one of the sweetest mares with a wonderful personality and nice ground manners when it comes to people handling her. She spent much of her first 4 years growing up without being backed -- she was handled regularly and pampered. She was very immature by the time she was 3 coming 4 so I thought the time off before getting started would be for the best. She is now 5 and has been under saddle for more than a year and a half. Initially, we tried lunging with side reins to help her understand what we wanted. I have worked with a Bereiter for over a year (he comes to my barn at least once a week). In a nutshell, my mare HATES dressage. She is not bred to be a dressage horse and it's obvious. We ruled out all possible problems -- soreness/feet/back/teeth issues and even had her getting massaged weekly which helped a little). My trainer says its because she's an alpha mare - she's difficult, doesn't like collection, doesn't like to give; gets tight/throws her head and resists light contact. With a ton of patience and effort, she is now softer, more submissive and round without tension (sometimes). BUT she will never be a dressage horse.

This mare was bred to be a jumper but I wanted to give her a solid dressage foundation because of the obedience required. She is not built for dressage & it doesn't come naturally or easily for her. Her breeding is KWPN x TB with Voltaire and Ramiro Z on top crossed with several Hall of Fame Canadian racehorses on the bottom (all within the first 3 generations). Show her a jump and her ears perk up and she actually seems happy.

I currently own 5 horses ranging from 2-5 years old (and have raised all of them from weaning or yearling up). Bottom line is some horses are easier than others (compare this mare to my 3-year old who was started and competed successfully at Devon within the first 3 months of being started). Some are not as rideable/trainable and that's why many breeders look to breed those horses that score higher on rideability and trainability. Find a job that's better suited for your horse because it's not worth fighting and if you try to force him into it, he'll only be bitter.

[Laura Coffey]

It has occurred to me that he's being asked to do the wrong job. At some point I will ask someone to jump him. He's certainly too hot to be a trail horse. Laura

[slc2]

It's hard to say without some more specifics. It's not clear what the horse is doing nor under what circumstances.

There are a couple possibilities:
1.) The rider is riding correctly, but lacks a necessary amount of firmness and immediate correction to ignored aids (escalation). The horse knows this, and sees the rider as an 'uncertain herd leader', and is constantly pushing her limits. Nature abhors a vacuum, and if a rider shows weakness, he can't lead. If the rider is unwilling to confront issues, the horse knows it. This can be in simple things, such as avoiding a part of the arena in which the horse has spooked, or turning the horse's head to one side if he doesn't want to accept connection on the other side of the bit. The degree to which the horse has to be obedient depends on the individual horse rather than the rider - what is too much for one horse, is way, way too little structure for others.

2.) The rider is making some technical mistakes. For example, the rider allows the horse to slow down as they pass by the gate, and he doesn't use his outside aids properly. The horse senses the 'hole' in the aids, and goes right through it - right out the gate, and if he's stopped, he stands up on his hind legs, and he can because he's not in front of the leg.

3.) The overall program is inappropriate for the horse. For example, a horse with a short back often takes a surprisingly long time to develop back muscles, and a rider can easily be fooled by a short back, that he is dealing with a STRONG back, when he isn't. This can lead a rider to expect more than the horse can deliver- the short backed horse may need months extra of posting at the trot before sitting the trot is done continuously. If it isn't done at all, the progress will also not be made.

These are just a couple examples of what can happen, and most horses aren't one of the above, but are combinations of various degrees of the above.

I think the toughest thing to learn as a rider is that he has to keep adjusting to various horses, and that every horse is different. I think it's AWFUL hard to see how demanding one needs to be with quite a few young horses.

You've worked mostly with off the track horses? You're used to a very, very different type of horse than what you have now. You'll have to make adjustments to this type of horse. Smart, thinking, very, very intelligent, and very, very able to spot holes in training, as well as having a little ole bit of that pony mind, and that is a very, very different type of mind.

I spent years and years working with 'Mr. Serious', a very, very quiet, thinking, cooperative kind of horse who was appalled at the idea of 'playing' during training or doing ANYTHING other than focus on his work and try his very best to do what is asked. It took one time, LITERALLY, ONCE, to teach him to half pass. He half passed across the entire ring the next time I tried, and every single time we came out of a corner, he went marching across the ring in half pass, a look of utmost concentration. Tolerant of errors, practically holding up a sign and asking permission if he felt the need to spook, and perfectly available for 'auto pilot' riding.

And as a wise old soul told me, 'Everyone should have one horse like him...but only one'.

Now I have the next step, which is Mr. You-and-Who-Else. Brilliant, talented, and ready to argue about just about everything. A very different sort of body - very collectable, VERY talented, and brilliantly able to find the slightest hole or imperfection in the rider's aids, AND make sure you know it, he wore a t-shirt, it would say, 'It's not me, it's Pilot Error', LOL. VERY intolerant of errors, and once he learns something, you have more trouble getting him to NOT do it than anything else. Don't sneeze - that's the aid for a flying change today, LOL.

They're all so different, and they each need something slightly different. If yours is showing you some shtank, she needs work and discipline, and an unshirking facing of what is the issue. What's the answer? Riding lessons from someone who is effective with this type of horse and riding.

[Laura Coffey]

Your comments are making a connection. A few weeks ago the weather got cold, and I hadn't been able to get to the barn for a few days. I thought I could get away with riding him with out lunging him...famous last words. I felt him sucking back at the gate,(and ignored it) there were several minor misbehavior's, then he hit his spooky spot and flew into the center of the ring. He thought that was so much fun he decided to do it again heading for the gate(he's gate sour). When he stopped at the gate I spanked him with the whip and sent him on. After he was disciplined I suddenly had a horse. By the same token if he feels like he's being treated unjustly ( worked too hard, disciplined unjustly) he will not accept it quietly.
Some folks from my area trailer over to Lendon Grey's barn for lessons a couple of times a month. She's supposed to be good with a variety of breeds.

[vickie lawson]

hi laura: i have heard connemara's have such a disposition (please don;t all hit me). you haven't said how old he is. how are his ground manners or is it only under saddle? with a highly intelligent and spirited horse, i like to keep the work interesting, and use different figures etc and of course catch him before he has a chance to be naughty. i tend to lunge with side reins to remove arguing. i get them to the point of being totally bored with the lunging and ready to cooperate with me when i get on, when they are argumentative. then as i said, keep the work interesting etc. cheers vickie

[Laura Coffey]

I just heard from the owner of Dee's sire who breeds Connemara's, she says and I quote...it's incredible how opinionated Connemara's are until you prove to them that you are worth listening to"... Laura

[slc2]

Oh isn't that the truth. I think of the few I've ridden, I'd put them at far, far more like a very well bred modern warmblood with a lot of Thoroughbred blood, from my experience they are also very, very smart, very quick and very much of the pony mind. Tons of potential, but very demanding of the rider - need discipline as well as skill.

[Laura Coffey]

LOL , On the up-side those of us who enjoy challenging beasties will never be bored. I don't know about you but my horse is one of my favorite puzzles, ( and I'm a psychotherapist). We will never fall asleep in the saddle. We shall remain physically fit, out of fear to life and limb. My newest addition to the list thanks to you is... I shall not be lazy and will stay on my horses case because it does make a difference. Thank you. Laura

[Jan Jollymour]

Hi, Laura:

All the Connemaras I have worked with have been talented, capable, and incredibly opinionated - actually not usually an amateur ride until they are well schooled! However, I also have often found that their riders take them somewhat for granted because they're on the small side, and they really do have a right to their opinions when they're asked to do crazy and impossible things. Most of those with whom I've worked have really come around when presented with a coherent, organized, and sensible training program.

Lendon Gray has no breed bias at all, and has taken a Connemara pony cross all the way to GP, so if she's available you should definitely follow up on that. Additionally, she has working students who could ride through some of the more challenging stuff for you if you need that kind of support

[Laura Coffey]

He's a piece of work, and sometimes he frustrates the *&^&**(%#%% out of me but he is making some progress. Last spring I couldn't even ride him around the ring. Now we can do serpentine's, mostly on the bit. I think hes going to be a great little horse.